“What direction should I go if I am passionate about creating larger pieces?”- Kayla Gale S2, E1

Jessica Craddock: I am here with the adorable and most lovely Kayla Gale. She is an oil painter from the Canadian prairies. She has two children. She homeschools, she's been painting oil paintings specifically for about eight, selling for about four to five. And she has successfully been able to turn it into her full-time rice and beans to make it the majority of how she's able to support her family, which is just really amazing and exciting and I'm so proud of you and we've.

I'm gonna say friends. Yeah. We've been friends for, uh, a couple of years now, and I've been following her on Instagram. And she has had just this amazing journey of being open and vulnerable and sharing her life and her ups and her downs. And some of them have been really tough and some of them have been really amazing and I love watching them.

Kayla Gale: Well, that's such a great intro. Thank you very much.

Jessica Craddock: You are so welcome.

Kayla Gale: I'm very happy to be here.

Jessica Craddock: I'm, I'm really happy that we could make it happen.

Yeah. Okay, so I would like to start off these calls by generally asking what is this biggest version of the vision that you were trying to create? And as we were kind of chatting back and forth in the Instagram DMs, she was like, I really want to do this, but I'm not exactly sure what my biggest vision is.

Yeah. When you were filling out the application, you said, I'm always evolving and I'm always growing. I don't know how to create goals. Like where do I go?

Kayla Gale: I don't know how to answer that question.

Jessica Craddock: So how did you get to the point where you felt like I am growing faster than I can create goals or like, what goes on in your head? Tell me a little bit more about it.

Kayla Gale: Okay.

I am not, I would say, not a hard and fast goal person. And I think to answer that question was really hard for me because it forced me to sit down and actually think of a solid place where I want to be. And I've never really done that before, and I know it's kind of encouraged.

It's kind of something you're supposed to do, but for me it's always just been, um, where am I right now and what do I wanna do next? So I would do that thing, and I would get there. And I'd be like, oh, this is a nice place to be. What do I wanna do next? And I'd get there, and I'd do that thing. And I'd be like, oh, I like this, but what do I wanna do next?

And it was just year after year of exploring a little bit over here and a little bit over there, and a little bit this and that. And I didn't have a direction where I was, I don't think, unless it was subliminal where I was going or what I wanted to do, but I just knew that I couldn't stop and I was just, I was having so much fun along the way.

I was enjoying it so much that it just felt like it was a natural progression of one step after the other.

Jessica Craddock: And honestly, I feel like that's a really healthy way to be.

Kayla Gale: It was for me. It was what I needed. I don't know, like I know it's encouraged to have a goal, and then you break that goal into achievable steps along the way.

But that's just not how it played out for me. And I, I think maybe a goal can sometimes be a little threatening for me. Like it's one big picture, whereas I like to just look at just the next thing that I have to do. Um, and so that was functional for me. And I don't know if it's functional for everyone, but that's how I got here.

Jessica Craddock: Well, that's actually a version of what I teach my clients. Like I no longer subscribe to the Let's have a goal, and let's map every step out to get there because you lose all the magic, all of the coincidences and the opportunities and all of that. You get so laser focused on this is what I'm supposed to do.

Kayla Gale: Right

Jessica Craddock: But at the same time, I do believe in having a North Star, and that's a little bit different to me than goal setting. It's more like, What I really want is to have a huge community that I am personally involved with, and I know that I'm really good at coaching. So I never want to stop coaching.

Kayla Gale: Mm-hmm.

Jessica Craddock: And I want to figure out a way so that those kinds of things where it's more like check boxes of how I want it to look rather than a, this is exactly what it will be.

Kayla Gale: Right.

Jessica Craddock: Does that make sense?

Kayla Gale: Yeah, that makes sense. More of a feeling than a checklist.

Jessica Craddock: A feeling and a, these are my strengths and I want to use them.

Kayla Gale: Right.

Jessica Craddock: And this is what lights me up. Yeah. So do you have anything like that?

Kayla Gale: Um, yes and no. I know what I really enjoy doing, and I've been thinking about it a lot lately, like when it comes to making money or it comes to work, if it was all about money, it'd be like I could flip burgers, I could be a lifeguard at the pool.

I could, I mean, there's lots of things that you can do to make money. What I want to do is to paint. I love painting. It is literally the thing that gives me butterflies. It's what I dream about when I sleep at night. I see brush strokes. I dream in color. Um, and so all I know, like I don't have this big, I don't think I have this big pull or this big calling, like you said.

What is the biggest version of yourself? It's hard for me to really answer that, but I do know that I want to be painting. Uh, more specifically, I really feel like I'm called to paint larger pieces. They just feel natural to me. They flow for me. And I want to do it in a, like a paced, sustainable way. I don't want it to be mass mayhem.

I would really like to achieve a calm in my studio, and I think every day I'm working towards that just to sort of be content, satisfied, calm, and flow .And that's how I see myself. Now, is that like a specific goal? Well, not really. I think that is my vision or my biggest version of myself is when I'm in that feeling of being calm, content, large pieces, flowing, just enjoying what I do.

Jessica Craddock: Well, you kind of exactly answered my question, so,

Kayla Gale: oh, okay. That's good.

Jessica Craddock: You're doing, you're doing great. Um, as far as

kind of switch gears, and not because it's all the same, but as far as business marketing, uh, that side of. Is there anything that feels good or feels bad, or do you not really know? Are you still kind of figuring out all of that? Tell me a little bit about that. Yeah.

Kayla Gale: Marketing does not feel good to me. I don't enjoy it at all.

I think it's an art form in itself, and I agree. Oh my goodness. Oh my goodness. It's so much an art form. And I just feel, I don't know, I come from this place where I would be making art, whether it's sold or not, you know? Mm-hmm. I, it's just what I do, self care, feel good, build myself up, um, give myself the reason to be who I am.

And so to market it and sell it to someone else feels unnatural to me because it's something that is kind of, you know. It's kind of just something that I do. And so I have a really hard time with marketing. It feels yucky and sticky and tight and constricted. And so that is something that I've constantly had to battle with, and that's something that I struggle with for sure.

Um,

Jessica Craddock: That's really interesting cuz I do not get that from you at all.

Kayla Gale: Oh, it's, it's bad.

Yeah.

Jessica Craddock: Define marketing. What is marketing to you?

Kayla Gale: Marketing to me is saying, uh, this is who I am, this is what I do. You should buy it. To me, that's what marketing is.

Jessica Craddock: What is your Instagram account to you?

Kayla Gale: Uh, and I've struggled with that. Is it just a journal of what I create? Is it a part of who I am, like do I share personal stuff there? Do people care about that? I'm not really sure. I try to find a nice balance of like, this is a little bit of me and this is a little bit of what I have for sale.

Mm-hmm. . And I hope that it resonates with someone. I just, I just really hope that it actually means something to someone. And when it does, it's like fireworks and lightning, and it's so exciting, but I'm more excited about the connection with the human than I am about, you know, the sales or the marketing or whatever.

So

Jessica Craddock: Can we just reframe it real quick?

Kayla Gale: Yeah.

Jessica Craddock: Because you're describing two different things, but they're the same thing. Like you're, you're saying marketing feels hard and icky and like I'm pushing to get it done.

Kayla Gale: Yes.

Jessica Craddock: But then you're also saying, When I connect with someone, it's like fireworks, and it's beautiful and lovely. And it's connection, and it's all those good things that I love.

Kayla Gale: Yeah, but to ask a sale like, okay, I feel like maybe the end goal is different. Mm-hmm. So to ask for a sale, you're asking someone for something. You're asking for their money. Of course, you have something to offer, very, very important. But you're asking for something, whereas the connection, I feel like I can give something to someone, like I'm making a connection.

It's more about me giving than asking.

Jessica Craddock: What if your selling was about you giving instead of asking?

Kayla Gale: Yeah. And that's a beautiful way to look at it. And that's probably how I should reframe giving.

Jessica Craddock: I teach my clients that selling is three things, and I'm gonna try to remember them all right now. On the spot. It”s connection.

Kayla Gale: Connection, yes.

Jessica Craddock: Helping.

Kayla Gale: Okay.

Jessica Craddock: And the third one, informing.

Kayla Gale: Okay, so connection I understand, but how am I helping and informing?

Jessica Craddock: Okay, so let me see how I can summarize a program really quickly. Um, so at the beginning you are making people aware you exist.

Kayla Gale: Yeah.

Jessica Craddock: More of visibility, and then in between visibility and selling, you are nurturing. You are making connections. You are getting to know people better. You are asking for recommendations.

You are promoting other people. You are just in this space of a reciprocal relationship, where you are giving and receiving at the same time.

Kayla Gale: Okay.

Jessica Craddock: Then when someone gets to the point of interest, Hey, I kind of like that painting. How do I buy that?

Kayla Gale: Yeah.

Jessica Craddock: Then we're at the selling and then it becomes, how can I help you figure out a way to get what you want?

Kayla Gale: Mm-hmm.

Jessica Craddock: You've already informed them because they know that you have the painting. So that is, that part is already done. Um, and we're still connecting with them. We're not just now, oh, now they want something, so now I get to sell something to them.

Kayla Gale: Mm-hmm.

Jessica Craddock: and go to this other weird place. We stay in the same kind of flow that we've been doing this whole time.

There's nurturing, connecting and just having real conversation. And then the helping part is more. Oh, that painting, I just, I love it so much and there's just no way I can afford it. So then it's maybe, can I help you figure out a payment plan? Or maybe it's, um, well instead of that, you know, how can we figure out how to make something for you that's a little bit lower price point.

Like, it's just that conversation of how do I help you get what you want because you told me you wanted it.

Kayla Gale: Okay. Yeah.

Jessica Craddock: That's marketing.

Kayla Gale: Okay.

Jessica Craddock: That's not probably the typical definition of marketing, but I teach relationship plus content marketing.

Kayla Gale: And isn't that connection?

Jessica Craddock: Connection.

Kayla Gale: Yeah. Like that's kind of, to me, that's what art is in a way, is it elicits a response from someone where you're like, oh, I feel the same way. Like, oh, I get this. I understand this. I feel this way. And so yeah, I can understand how marketing art would naturally have to be born from that. That makes a lot of sense.

Jessica Craddock: Absolutely.

Kayla Gale: So I teach this thing where art sells because of connection. Right. And how are the different ways that people can connect with you? So maybe it's because of you, maybe it's because of the message of the art and what you're sharing about yourself. Maybe it's like actually how it looks and what the subject matter is, but there's all these different ways that people can connect with your art.

Jessica Craddock: Right. And so the marketing is just the same thing.

Kayla Gale: Yeah.

Jessica Craddock: It's all about connection. If you try to just, I'm gonna use air quotes, market my art, and I'm gonna write four social media posts and one email. And I'm gonna use the right call to action, and I'm gonna blah, blah, blah. You're not gonna do very well unless you have really large numbers, or unless your art is just so spectacularly unique that people can't help but share it like crazy.

Kayla Gale: Right? Yeah. Yeah.

Jessica Craddock: And that's not to say that either one of those things can't exist, but that's just not the norm. That's not how most people are going to be successful in marketing, selling, and sharing art.

Kayla Gale: And maybe that's also not what feels the nicest.

Then you kind of feel like a car salesman, like you kind of feel it's a little more, well, you take that connection out of it. It's basically like numbers, you know?

Jessica Craddock: Yeah. Can I sell to you? Will you, can I say the right thing? Can I convince you? Yuck.

Kayla Gale: Gross. And that's gross.

Jessica Craddock: No one likes that.

Kayla Gale: Yeah. And that's, that's the sticky, yucky part to me.

And so that's, that's where a reframe I think would be really good for me because I don't like that. The idea of having to do that with painting, especially, something that's, I don't know, just really from my heart.

Jessica Craddock: Okay. Yeah.

Kayla Gale: It shouldn't feel sticky like that at the end. That shouldn't be the end of the painting. Ugh, that's gross.

So it should feel like a natural flow going to someone. I sold a painting to, um, someone that I had worked with. We did an art show in October and I made this linen painting. I brought it to the show and she saw it. And she just loved it, and she talked about it. And when that painting sold, I just felt like the cycle of that artwork was complete because it was like, yes, that belongs with her. It truly belongs in her home. It was nostalgic for her. It put this look on her face when she saw it, and I was like, yes, that's the complete. You know, now it's complete. That's the end of it. And that's to me how it should feel.

It should not feel like, um, this many dollar bills and, you know,

Jessica Craddock: Transactional,

Kayla Gale: Right? Yeah, exactly.

Jessica Craddock: So it's the cycle of the painting. That's beautiful. I love that.

Kayla Gale: Yeah. Yeah.

Jessica Craddock: And I also have a sticky note on my window. It says, sales is just a connection and a conversation. To be perfectly honest, for the longest time I had the same problem.

I was like, I don't want to convince. I want people to buy because they want it, and that is it. Um, and once I kind of really adopted that as a fundamental belief it kind of changed everything. I just stopped selling.

Kayla Gale: Yeah.

Jessica Craddock: And not, I started making more sales, but I stopped trying to sell.

Kayla Gale: Trying to sell, yeah.

Jessica Craddock: I just had a conversation with someone and if they said I want it, I said, great. And if they said, I don't want it, I said, great. Well, maybe some other time.

Kayla Gale: Yeah. Right.

Jessica Craddock: Move on. 

Kayla Gale: Right.

Jessica Craddock: If you don't wanna buy something from me, I'm not going to try to twist your arm.

Kayla Gale: Try to sell it to you. Yeah. And you know what, sometimes they just don't belong with that person.

Jessica Craddock: Exactly.

Kayla Gale: And maybe that, maybe there's another person right after that that actually belongs to. And so yeah. I get where you're coming from there. More of a conversation.

Definitely. Yeah.

Jessica Craddock: We are trying to reframe marketing into something that is desirable. It's its own art form. It's just an extension of the art really. It's that same connection that you have. It's from the heart. It's love. It's all these beautiful things that you already have. We're just trying to turn the switch a little bit.

Kayla Gale: Yeah.

Jessica Craddock: Um, you also said calm, flow, which I think would definitely come along with adopting that new belief. And you also said large scale pieces.

Kayla Gale: Oh yeah. Oh,

Jessica Craddock: You wanna dig into that for a second?

Kayla Gale: Yeah, that is so, okay. That just feels so freeing to me. So I feel like it is going to school and doing a math exam, to work small.

Jessica Craddock: Okay. Okay. I was like, this doesn't sound .

Kayla Gale: Yeah, no. And then, okay, so maybe it's like learning the foxtrot, like there's an art to it and it's beautiful, but it's very, step by step. When I work small, it feels constricted. Mm-hmm. . But when I work big, and I have this big six foot canvas, right now I'm working on a 10 foot tapestry, it's like going to a friend's barn dance and just kicking your shoes off and dancing.

Like it's just so much different and it's still artful. And it still takes a lot of skill, and you still have to, you know, make something come of it. But it just feels so freeing, and I love that. And so I, a couple of months ago realized this about myself, that yes, it is important that I do small works because it is going to force me into an uncomfortable place. And it's going to make me practice, and it's gonna make me focus, very important.

But I also have to nourish this other side of me where I just get in the flow, and it just feels so exciting and so refreshing, and so like, breathe open space, move my arms, move my body, and it becomes like a whole thing. Um, and so I was like, you know what? If that's what I want to be doing, then I guess I better just darn well do it.

And I built myself this big studio. I didn't build it, but I cleaned out a place that I can work and painted a big white wall and got myself some huge frames and stretched some huge canvas, and I did it. I painted them, I changed my Instagram profile to say that I'm a painter of large scale pieces. And I put them out there and it was crickets for a little while. I won't lie.

And I think it's because it was maybe something new for my audience who was used to spending, you know, $300 to $500 and now I'm like in the thousands of dollars. But it's working. They're selling. And I got a commission for a 10 foot tapestry. And so it's kind of just like, if you're going to do it, do it.

It feels so good because I really do think that's where I belong. I think that's where my heart is. Uh, I realize that's not a calling for everyone. Some people really like working small. But for me, I know what I like. I was like, if you're gonna do it, if that's what you're calling is, well then, why aren't you there yet?

And I just had to get going on that. So, oh, butterflies. I just get goosebumps thinking about it. I love it so much.

Jessica Craddock: I think part of the reason why is because you didn't like just stick a toe in and get scared and say,

Kayla Gale: Yeah, that's not me.

Jessica Craddock: Really. No. The way you just described it, you basically jumped into the pool and said okay,

sink or swim.

Kayla Gale: Yep. Basically.

And I won't lie. There were a few stressful moments where I said to my husband, that's it. I quit. I'm gonna, I'm gonna get a job somewhere else, and I'm done. And sure enough, ding went my Squarespace alert. And so yeah, like, I know it sink or swim. And I do think maybe you sink a little bit first.

Maybe you sink first.

Jessica Craddock: I think you always sink first.

Kayla Gale: Yeah.

Jessica Craddock: No, that's not true. I think you get a little bit of, once you decide, I think almost always you get this little win and you're like, ooh, okay. Maybe, maybe I can do this. And then it gets harder. And maybe a little bit even harder after that. And then when it starts working.

Kayla Gale: Yeah.

Jessica Craddock: It's like you gotta, you gotta prove you really want it. You, it's gonna, you'll get a little bit of something.

Kayla Gale: I love that. I love that. I love that you have to prove that you want it, because I really think that not everyone is called to making art. Okay. I think we're all artists. Making and selling art.

It's not as easy as a lot of people think it is.

Jessica Craddock: Well, that two whole things too.

Kayla Gale: Oh my God.

Oh yeah. So, um, yeah, you gotta prove, I mean, if there are nights you gotta stay up till three in the morning painting. There are nights where you have to send out tons of emails and you just don't feel like it. It is a lot of really, really hard work, and you have to prove that that's where you belong.

You have to earn it. And so that's, to me, what gives me the confidence, I think, that I do belong here because I'm not wishy-washy. If I want it, I know I have to work for it, and I'm okay with that.

Jessica Craddock: I agree with that. And I just want to say, because we get the message that you have to work hard, work hard, work hard, work hard, or you won't get it.

Jessica Craddock: And sometimes, sometimes working harder is not necessarily the answer. Sometimes it's taking a step back, breathing, filling your cup, reevaluating.

I see this face that you're doing and also I remember how you are like, but I'm a workaholic, and I get that. I get it.

Kayla Gale: Yeah.

Jessica Craddock: And I absolutely am as well, but I have learned that to this day, I have to push myself to do it, but when I take better care of myself and I take the time to say, I liked this. I didn't like that. This worked. Like just take in a minute to breathe and look at all the things and go for a walk and all of that. Yeah. I feel like that's when you can get into this flow, calm, content.

And yes, you do have to work and probably even work hard, but if you only work hard, you're gonna dig yourself into this hole.

Kayla Gale: I heard a great quote the other day, and I'm so sorry. I don't remember who it was or where I saw it. But the thoughts stayed with me was that when we rest, We, and she said it in such a beautiful way. I'll never be able to repeat it.

But when we rest, we actually make room for our most important work or our best work. Just the way she said it was like, if you don't rest, you're gonna be working, working, working, working, working. You're gonna do all the busy work maybe. Okay. But when you do allow yourself to rest, and when you take time to notice the small things, like you said, go for a walk or just observe, that's when you're making room, you're opening up space for your best work to come.

Jessica Craddock: I call it making room for inspiration, but it's the same thing.

Kayla Gale: Yeah. Okay, sure. Yes. Inspiration. There you go. And I came into this like a couple years back when I was just getting started. It was like, you don't wait for inspiration. You make it happen no matter what. You know, like if you really want it, you're not gonna just wait for inspiration to just happen to you.

 You've got to make your dream come true.

Jessica Craddock: I won't disagree with that, but also,

Kayla Gale: Take a deep breath, Kayla. Exist. I really struggle with that. That is something that I really, really have to work on. Yeah.

Jessica Craddock: I do believe that to some degree, and it's not like an on demand thing, but I do think that you can create more inspiration.

By that mandatory rest time and you're like, I am turning off my computer. Yes. I really, even if I'm gonna turn off my computer, I wanna be writing a newsletter in my head. But I'm not gonna let myself do that either. I am going to turn the switch off, and I'm gonna go sledding on my hill with my kids because they really want me to.

And they've been waiting all day. And almost every time something then magically comes, and I don't really have to work that hard for it. It just appears, like your reward.

Kayla Gale: Yes.

Jessica Craddock: And when I'm like, I need my reward, I'm going for a walk. Dang it. That doesn't work. You have to like surrender and turn off before it will come. So that is my experience anyway. You can and you can't force it.

Kayla Gale: I can definitely relate to that. Yeah. That's awesome. Yeah.

Jessica Craddock: If I could help you with one problem related to making, selling, marketing, getting large pieces in general, is there any problem I can help you solve?

Well, ,

Kayla Gale: I mean, you could help me solve a lot of problems. You're kind of brilliant that way.

Jessica Craddock: Oh, thank you.

Kayla Gale: But do you have any suggestions as to where one might reach, um, directionally, like, which direction should I go if I'd like to sell bigger pieces?

Would it be crazy to turn out of the public sector, into maybe design or trades?

Jessica Craddock: Okay. Here's the thing. There is no wrong answer. The right answer.

Kayla Gale: Yeah.

Jessica Craddock: It's the one where you feel the most lit up about it, not, well, what is the right answer? What should I do? What is the best? Like what is everybody else doing? All of that,

Kayla Gale: Right.

Jessica Craddock: But this is why we need that North star moment. Because maybe the North Star does not say specifically interior designer versus storefronts, but maybe it does say, I want to collaborate more. Or. Like one of my clients specifically recently said something about how she didn't necessarily want to sell originals because she wanted her art everywhere.

So she wanted to go more into the realm of getting her stuff printed on bags and all of that, where a lot of people will want to do that because they think it would be a good passive source of income. But that was actually her passion. She wanted to see her art everywhere she went. And I was like, that's really cool.

I don't hear that from a lot of people.

Kayla Gale: Yeah, that's kind of neat.

Jessica Craddock: But that helped her decide what direction she wanted to go. So like with her, um, at the moment we are specifically reaching out to companies that can help her do that. So for you, The right answer is not the same as her. Obviously, you're doing completely different things.

That was just an example.

Kayla Gale: Yeah.

Jessica Craddock: But a lot of people think, well, I should try to go with designers, storefronts or like all, all of these different things. And again, none of those are wrong. Right. But is there any way that pulls at you a little bit more from the, that sounds more fun, perspective.

Kayla Gale: Well, and that's maybe why I'm asking because I have sold, um, I have sold to people that I make this connection with, and that brings me, I mean, there's absolutely no downside to that.

There's, it's just a beautiful thing, and you almost form a relationship. It's very, very special. But I've also been approached, and this is, this is again maybe where that North Star moment comes in, is I've been approached by people, specifically women, who are running their own business, um, opening up their own storefront, running a design company or like interior design. This one really inspiring woman, in a city nearby is a trades person and does kitchens and things like that.

Just really, really inspiring people that I would be really honored to work with.

Jessica Craddock: Mm-hmm.

Kayla Gale: And I think, well that's exciting because it's not so much about, again, marketing or selling, but it's like, I would really like to work with that person because she inspires me. And I would love to have a place in her store or in her space because I respect her, and I think she's got a good thing going on.

And it would be like, you know, I'd feel honored. So I think maybe that's maybe where I'm going a little bit more is working with women, or, I mean, individuals who just have that talent and that eye for good design and can see what pulls the space together is like that perfect piece, you know, that artwork, the mood, the aesthetic. I would love to be a part of that.

That'd be an honor.

Jessica Craddock: Can I tell you what I heard? ,

Kayla Gale: blah, blah, blah, blah, blah, blah, blah, blah.

Jessica Craddock: No, no, no. Not at all.

 I heard that you don't really care. You just want that connection with someone. Yeah.

Kayla Gale: Yeah.

Jessica Craddock: And if they are also passionate individuals who have a creative lifestyle, all the better because that's one of your connection points.

Kayla Gale: Right? Yeah.

Jessica Craddock: I think that you have a really special gift for connecting with your audience, and I would hate to see you give that up, completely, ever, unless for whatever reason you just did not want that anymore. That would be different.

Kayla Gale: Okay?

Jessica Craddock: But there is nothing wrong with saying, I am going to sell my art.

I'm going to complete these pieces' cycles. I'm gonna give them new homes, I'm gonna make new connections. I'm gonna grow relationships. I'm gonna do all these beautiful things, and this amazing person over here wants to work with me.

Kayla Gale: Right.

Jessica Craddock: I'm gonna do that as well. Yeah. And you, when, once you do that, you may find that your North Star shifts a little bit, and you just really love that. And you want that to be 75% of your business.

Kayla Gale: Yeah.

Jessica Craddock: 25% is the connection. The thing that I worry about is that with this voice in your head saying something along the lines of, I don't like selling, that you would steer one direction because of that voice.

Kayla Gale: Yes, and I think you've hit the nail in the head there because yeah, if someone else could do the selling for me, that's great.

Jessica Craddock: I get it.

Kayla Gale: Yeah.

Jessica Craddock: I'm saying this a lot with you and, and, I, in my soul believe that if you made it a point to find a way of selling that felt really good for you and aligned and beautiful, that you would fall in love with selling. It's normally the thing that we're the most afraid of. That is the one that's gonna put all the pieces together.

Kayla Gale: Right. Yeah. Yep. Yep. I know you're right.

Jessica Craddock: So if I told you to avoid it because it would be easier and you wouldn't have to do the thing, I feel like you would miss such a beautiful opportunity in there.

Kayla Gale: Yeah, that's right. And I know that's right because there was one time where I felt just amazing and that was selling to someone in person rather than via the website. And it was because I could read all their body cues. I could see the look on her face, and I was just like, yes, this is like I got, I got those fireworks because I knew it was something that she was so happy to take home and be a part of her space.

And that felt good. That felt really good.

Jessica Craddock: And I also know that you have a decent sized following on Instagram that you have built and don't want you to just poof it away because in-person selling stuff feels great.

There are different layers like Zoom or even like voice messaging or like all of those different avenues. It does not have to be just click to buy on my website.

Kayla Gale: Definitely.

Jessica Craddock: It can be let's have a conversation.

Kayla Gale: Yeah. Yeah, definitely. Yeah. And I think that would be great with commissions too,

 like a Zoom connection or a face-to-face?

Jessica Craddock: A hundred percent.

Kayla Gale: Yeah.

Jessica Craddock: Okay. So what are your takeaways?

Kayla Gale: I knew you're gonna say that. Um, I think I have to do the reframe, like you said. I just maybe need to change the direction of my thoughts and my feelings a little bit when it comes to

offering my art. Mm. Right. Or helping is the word that you said. Right?

Jessica Craddock: So inside of whatever content you're putting out there, or whenever you're talking to people, we don't have to offer. We don't even have to offer. We just say, here's what I'm working on. Here's what I'm doing. Here's the thing I'm excited about.

Here's the thing I love. I'm making this cool thing. You want to hear about it? It's amazing.

Kayla Gale: Yeah.

Jessica Craddock: That is informing.

Kayla Gale: That feels good.

Jessica Craddock: You don't have to say, would you like to buy my thing? I mean, like, maybe there's times in your business where that is a thing where you have to do that. Yeah. But for the most part, it's just about informing.

Kayla Gale: Right? Yeah.

Jessica Craddock: Okay. Continue.

Kayla Gale: Okay. And then following my North Star. I think I have a strong intuition. I have a strong gut. My gut knows where it wants to go. I just can't clutter it with other voices and fine tuning where, you know what feels good to me, where I need to go.

Jessica Craddock: What feels the best? And not because it's an uncomfortable moment, but how do I make it feel the best if it's something that I need to do?

Kayla Gale: Right. Yeah, yeah, and maybe a little bit of rest once in a while.

Jessica Craddock: Well, a crow just flew by. That means yes. They're my yes bird. So. Oh, there's another one. You got two crows. See my little crow back there?

Kayla Gale: Nice.

Jessica Craddock: Anyway. All right, can I just say how lovely this was.

Kayla Gale: This was nice.

Jessica Craddock: And thank you, thank you for doing it with me.

Kayla Gale: For sure. Thank you very much.

Jessica Craddock: Absolutely. And if someone wanted to find you, where would be the best place for them to go?

Kayla Gale: Um, I would love it if people came directly to my website, Kayla Gale.com. G A L E. Well, or my Instagram, because on my Instagram then I can chat with you.

And so my Instagram is @slow.season.

Jessica Craddock: Slow dot season.

Kayla Gale: Yeah.

Jessica Craddock: Which I feel like is an intention that you set for yourself.

Kayla Gale: That was an intention that I set many years ago when my children were born. I knew I was entering into this new season of life, and it had to be a slower one because I had to appreciate it.

And every day when I open my Instagram, or every day when I go into my studio, I'm like, okay, you have to slow down. I'm not good at it. I'm really bad at that. It's very hard, but it is important.

Jessica Craddock: It is. I think you just kinda learn, you see the proof of, okay, it's better when I'm slow, and then you can remind yourself using that proof later. That's the easier part.

Kayla Gale: I think you begin to trust yourself. Once you start to do a little bit, you trust yourself a little bit more with it.

Jessica Craddock: It's a lifelong thing. That's okay.

Okay.

Kayla Gale: All right.